Washington Post — It feels right that Jodie Comer became famous playing an assassin. Because her acting instincts are killer.

Each year we photograph Tony nominees, and talk with them about their craft. This year we focused on actors.
“Everyone always said theater was incomparable, like there was nothing like it, and I never understood what they meant. When you’re in a room of that many people all experiencing something at the same time, the energy is electrifying, and that has been one of the greatest joys about this experience. It’s intoxicating.” — Jodie Comer
The star of ‘Killing Eve’ and Broadway’s acclaimed ‘Prima Facie’ talks about the challenges and epiphanies of a theater debut.


But by that time she was also Emmy winner Jodie Comer, earner of die-hard fans for “Killing Eve,” the 2018 BBC series that made her a bona fide sensation. Her portrayal of Villanelle, a coolheaded Russian psychopath, not only made her bankable, it also delivered an accent that was convincing enough to bamboozle Suzie Miller, “Prima Facie’s” author.
“When we came up with Jodie, Suzie was like, ‘We can’t employ her. She’s Russian,’” recalled the play’s director, Justin Martin. “And I was like, ‘She’s not Russian. She’s English!’”
It was through this singular set of circumstances that Comer — sans the validating credentials from RADA or Lamda or Central School of Drama — came to make her stage debut in Miller’s one-person play about Tessa, an overachieving London barrister. Tessa proudly trumpets the cases she’s won for her clients, men accused of sexual assault. Then “Prima Facie” makes its own sordid case clear when the justice tables turn on her.
The role is a daunting launchpad for a theater neophyte, an intense and grueling 100-minute test of concentration and stamina. After the play was announced, Martin took Comer to the Harold Pinter Theatre in London’s West End so she could stand on the empty stage and get a feel for the 796-seat house. The experience probably should have freaked her out a bit. It didn’t.
“I mean, I was awestruck, but I wasn’t intimidated,” Comer said. “Yeah, I wasn’t. I think Justin, what he was expecting maybe was for me to get to that moment and go, ‘Oh, God!’”
Where she did go was straight to work, but not without taking up Martin and producer James Bierman on their offers for help.
Actors who’ve achieved renown can grow leery of taking on a new play. I spoke recently with a director who ticked off the names of actors known for intelligence and success crossing over into movies — none of whom were eager to risk being in a new play. A work in its freshman viewing places a sizable burden on a star. There’s no reliable road map, and so with the uncharted choices the production makes, performers may worry they will be held responsible for road bumps.
Comer, who had some film and TV experience before “Killing Eve,” didn’t count on an actor’s life growing up, though her talents were noticed. “It seems pretty clear I was a very confident child, you know, very silly,” she said. “Always putting on like shows or impressions.” In school, she said, the reports were, “I was very chatty. It was always, you know, ‘Chats too much. Social, yeah, needs to focus a little bit more, less talking.’”
When she was about 12, she performed a monologue in school, and that led to a role in a radio play. Her parents — a physiotherapist father and a mother who worked at a transport company in Liverpool — never stood in her way. But the way wasn’t paved for her. She has pointed out in award acceptance speeches that she didn’t have the advantage of conservatory training, and as Martin put it, “There’s a mania for that” in the theater world.
“Prima Facie,” too, had some prior success, having been performed in Miller’s native Australia before London, although neither the play nor the playwright were well known outside her home turf. A human rights lawyer by training, with 15 years in criminal law, Miller said that she found herself perplexed when she studied sexual assault in law school.
“I remember thinking when it came to sexual assault, there was something amiss,” she said in an interview in the lower lobby of the Golden Theatre on West 45th Street, where “Prima Facie” had its official opening last week. “And I thought: The defense is always, ‘There was consent. I believe there was consent.’ Right. So what — they just have to believe it’s there? And you can do anything you like?”
Miller has written several plays, but “Prima Facie,” which premiered in Sydney in 2019, has struck a particularly resonant chord. “It’s just been translated into nearly 30 languages,” she recounted. “It’s been done in China. It’s being done in Japan. It’s astonishing. Turkey! A place where they said, ‘We really have to have this on.’
“And the great thing for me that’s happened: thousands and thousands of messages from women telling me their story, which you know, like sometimes it’s hard to read them. I just think, ‘How do you go out in the world and think the world is a safe place?’”
Tessa’s background was changed for “Prima Facie” in London, where the character’s origins became Liverpool — the same as Comer’s. “She was also present in the rehearsal process,” Comer said of Miller. “I don’t know if that is necessarily usual, but she made sure she was there I think because everything was very new to me, and she wanted me to feel like I was supported.”
Comer and her director got the production up on its feet simply by getting up on their own.
“What we didn’t do is stand around and talk about a lot. We just got up and we did it,” said Martin, describing Comer as intuitively gifted and eager to learn. “She’s very honest about what she knows and doesn’t know. She will stand up for things that she thinks are important. But she’s always collaborative.”
Comer — who flew back to London earlier this month to receive the Olivier Award, the West End’s equivalent of a Tony, for her performance as Tessa — said she approached the experience with a student’s thirst for knowledge. “I knew when I was going into this, I was like, ‘I am going to grow so much,’” she said. “I don’t know how, but I know that this is going to stretch me in a way that I’ve never been challenged before.”
So unaccustomed was she to the ways of the stage that Martin had to walk her through the ritual of acknowledging the audience’s applause.
“I said, ‘Now we are going to do the bows,’ and she came up to me and she said, ‘I didn’t know — How do we do that?’” Martin recalled. “I was like, ‘What do you mean?’ And I just took her hand and we stood up there and we bowed together.”
Watching Comer in “Killing Eve” and, in a very different vein, her performance in the 2021 BBC film “Help” about caregivers in Liverpool, you’re jarred by the idea of the actress needing instruction on how to perform a curtain call. Especially as she confesses to having been an extrovert all her life.
Miller’s play so called out to her that she carved out time for “Prima Facie,” even though she had to say no to big film projects such as Ridley Scott’s “Napoleon.” “It was always very clear that the play was what was right for me,” she said. “And I think there were a few people who thought I was insane.”
She went with her gut, though, and perhaps the validation is the audience’s nightly response. “From a soul perspective and what I actually believe in, it was clear,” she said of the decision to pivot to the stage — and to Tessa. “It’s like, no, I know this, I feel it in my body.”
Comer sometimes feels the impact on the street, too — the ubiquity of Tessa’s tragedy.
“This woman walked past me,” she recalled, “and then she came back around the corner. And she said, ‘I’ve seen the play, and you know, I really enjoyed it, it was incredible. Thank you so much.’ And there was something in the way that she looked at me. I just held her gaze. And there was like an acknowledgment. You know, like she wasn’t saying anything, but she was saying everything.”
“I had an amazing vocal coach, and I did a couple of movement classes just to become more aware of my body, because I realized, having done a lot of television and film so close up, you’re not always having to be aware of how your body is emoting or projecting energy,” Comer said. “And I suddenly realized, ‘Oh, hang on a minute, like I have to use from the tip of my head to the tip of my toes!’”
Comer, 30, and I spoke recently in a chic dining spot in Manhattan’s Meatpacking District. She was refreshingly without pretense: I showed up 15 minutes early for the interview. So did she. It was not a fake-chummy encounter, but rather a straightforward chat about the task at hand. When the check came, I offered to pay. She said, “Let’s split it.” So we did.

Jodie Comer became a household name after starring in Killing Eve, scooping multiple awards—including an Emmy and a BAFTA—for her portrayal of Villanelle in the series. At the Olivier Awards on Sunday night, the star added another statue to her trophy cupboard, picking up the Best Actress gong for her West End debut as a conflicted young barrister, Tessa, in Prima Facie.


“This was a really significant moment in time for me, and I wanted a dress that would make the occasion all the more memorable,” says Comer who, with the help of her stylist Elizabeth Saltzman, picked a sculptural poly faille dress for what would become her winning night, from Alexander McQueen’s most recent fall 2023 collection.
The actor serendipitously came across a quote once said by the house’s late founder, Lee Alexander McQueen, on Instagram as she was deciding what to wear for the ceremony. McQueen once said he designed clothes because he didn’t want women to look “all innocent and naïve”. “I don’t like women to be taken advantage of,” the designer said. “I don’t like men whistling at women in the street. I think they deserve more respect… I know what misogyny is… I want people to be afraid of the women I dress.”
Comer, whose character in Prima Facie specializes in defending men accused of sexual assault, and then herself becomes a victim of assault, was instantly struck by the quote, she says. “It really resonated with me and it felt so appropriate given Prima Facie’s themes and messaging. It also felt like a little sign from the universe that McQueen was the perfect choice for my first Olivier Awards,” asserts the actor.
Saltzman, who has worked with the former British Vogue cover star since her Killing Eve days, echoes her sentiment: “McQueen has always been a brand that embraces a strong confident woman,” she tells Vogue, adding: “When anyone slips into a McQueen, you feel instantly empowered.” The moment she saw Sarah Burton’s latest collection, shown at Paris Fashion Week in March, she fell in love with Look 22, captivated by its striking red shade—a trending color to emerge on the recent red carpets and runways—and cascading ruffles.
The deconstructed trench silhouette taps into the “anatomy of tailoring” theme that Burton explored this season, which the creative director said was inspired by the beginnings of McQueen on Savile Row. “It was a progression, which starts very kind of straight and structured. And then it begins to flash and twist and turn upside down,” Burton explained. “It’s like how you begin with a garment—you have to know that there’s a way to construct it, the bones of it, before you can dissect it and subvert it.”




Jodie Comer stars this spring in Prima Facie, which begins previews at the John Golden Theatre on April 11. Valentino shirt. Gucci pants. The Row loafers. Cartier watch. Fashion Editor: Max Ortega.Photographed by Norman Jean Roy, Vogue, March 2023.
Between 2018 and 2022, Jodie Comer became a star with her virtuoso performance as the gorgeous, gleefully sociopathic assassin Villanelle on the BBC America series Killing Eve, winning a BAFTA and an Emmy and causing everyone to freak out about how great she was. But what she’d always wanted to do was act on the stage. As a 12-year-old in Liverpool, she won first prize at a local drama festival for a monologue about the 1989 Hillsborough Stadium disaster, and at 17 she appeared in a play called The Price of Everything at a theater-in-the-round in Scarborough, North Yorkshire. Still, despite continuing to audition for theatrical roles while she worked in TV and film throughout her teens and 20s, the stage remained elusive. “A lot of the feedback was great,” Comer tells me over tea in New York in her unvarnished Scouse accent. (She is apartment shopping in the city when we meet, a big step after living at home with her parents and younger brother for much of the pandemic.) “But one thing that was resounding was, like, ‘She hasn’t been to drama school and this is too big a task for someone who isn’t classically trained.’ I used to feel quite defeated by that.”
Not one to take “maybe” for an answer, the 29-year-old made her professional stage debut last year with Prima Facie, a stunning one-woman piece by Australian playwright Suzie Miller. In it, Comer gave a critically acclaimed, Evening Standard Award–winning performance as Tessa Ensler (Miller’s nod to The Vagina Monologues author Eve Ensler, now known as V), a razor-sharp young defense lawyer whose facility in the courtroom—especially in cases dealing with sexual assault—becomes effectively meaningless when she must take the stand herself after being raped. Alienated and traumatized, she is quickly disabused of the notion that the legal games she once loved to play had anything to do with seeking justice. “She knows that she’s fiercely intelligent, and she owns that,” Comer says of Tessa, who is all swaggering bravado when the play begins. “She takes joy in her great power. And, of course, that makes the fall—when she’s forced to face everything from the other side—even harder.”
Prima Facie is now headed from the West End to Broadway’s John Golden Theatre, where New York audiences will get to discover in Comer what Justin Martin, the show’s director (The Jungle), saw from the start. “Fundamentally, she’s a stage animal,” he says. “She has an incredible sense of humor and an emotional rawness. She’s very, very honest and absolutely fearless. And all of that bleeds into her performance and the choices that she makes onstage. It’s a natural home for her.”
For Miller’s part, she was so persuaded by what she’d seen in Killing Eve that she didn’t initially realize Comer was English. When her name first came up, “I said, ‘Why would we cast a Russian actor?’ ” the playwright remembers with a laugh. Discovering that Comer shared the working-class background Miller had written for Tessa—who has learned to take advantage of being underestimated—moved her to the top of the list.
As research, Comer and the creative team got to spend time at the Central Criminal Court of England and Wales—more commonly known as the Old Bailey—and observe London barristers at work. (After attending law school at the University of New South Wales, Miller practiced as a human rights and criminal defense lawyer until 2010, when she shifted to playwriting full-time.) “It very much felt like theater,” Comer recalls. “Everyone was playing their role, everyone knew their lines, everyone knew when to come in and when not to come in. It felt presentational in that way, like acting. But the stakes were so incredibly high.” When I suggest that Tessa querying a witness might not be a far throw from Villanelle toying with a victim before swooping in for the kill, Comer says, “Absolutely. She’s like a bird with its prey. She’s having so much fun—playing around with him, making it painful. She’s like, This guy is a fucking idiot, and he has no clue what’s about to come.”
Yet the minds behind Prima Facie also recognize the responsibility they have, staging a 100-minute play about the many ways that a legal system devised by men can fail survivors of sexual violence. “It just felt like we would not be doing our job if we didn’t, as people left the theater, give them some way to deal with what they’ve experienced and hopefully effect some change,” says producer James Bierman. So, the production formed a partnership with Everyone’s Invited, a digital platform where survivors can anonymously share their stories, as well as the Schools Consent Project, a charity devoted to educating teenagers about consent and sexual assault. (Based in the UK, it is due to begin operations Stateside this spring.) “If you want to watch Prima, and you like what Prima stands for, then you have to engage with this, because the two things are absolutely linked,” Bierman adds. “The play doesn’t exist in a vacuum. It exists in a world where Tessa is all too real.”
The response to the play has already been overwhelming; in Australia, where Prima Facie premiered in 2019, and again in England, “we just got so many messages from women,” Miller says. “Handwritten letters dropped off at the stage door, email after email, DMs…I mean, I’ve gotten hundreds a day of women saying, ‘This is what happened to me.’ ” In the long shadow of the #MeToo movement, she finds that now more than ever, “audiences are hungry to have conversations about systems that govern; systems around them that they don’t think are innately fair.” Happily, this isn’t just a show that talks—it’s one that absolutely roars.

As Killing Eve reaches its finale, shape-shifting star Jodie Comer talks to Rosamund Dean about how her gritty West End debut took priority over Ridley Scott’s next epic





Photoshoots > 2022 > Session 006-Evening Standard Magazine
Last month, Jodie Comer was in a studio to record her last bits of dialogue for the final ever episode of Killing Eve. ‘It was surreal,’ she says, eyes wide. ‘They had this sofa in the centre of the screen, so I sat there and asked them to play me the final moments. I was like… wow.’
We’re meeting for breakfast in a Mayfair members’ club the day before her 29th birthday. Comer is not having a party though. Last weekend she had a family dinner in Liverpool (the tasting menu at Röski, which she recommends as ‘it lasts about three hours so you really have time to catch up’) and, on the day, she is going to see Small Island at the National Theatre with a friend. As she tucks in to overnight oats and an espresso, I dig for spoilers of the Killing Eve finale. Many are hoping Eve and Villanelle will get together and go off into the sunset. ‘Yeah, I mean…’ she laughs, with a raised eyebrow.
But then again, the show is literally called Killing Eve, which doesn’t bode well for Eve. ‘Well, you’d think that, but is it ‘Killing’ Eve? Or is it Killing ‘Eve’?’ she asks, mysteriously. ‘Eve’s changed so much, especially in this series. I was like whoa, Sandra!’
Villanelle is, of course, Russian. Which, in series one, felt kind of retro Cold War but now feels much darker. Continuing to live our normal lives — in my case, chatting to an actor — with pictures of Ukrainian devastation on every front page is a strange business. ‘Everything else is so insignificant,’ says Comer. ‘The world right now is extremely sinister. Russian people are being fed so much misinformation. It’s terrifying when you realise there are people in power who have the ability to do that, and choose to do that. And the number of people who are none the wiser.’
The show won Comer an Emmy and a Bafta, and launched her in Hollywood. Last year she starred in Free Guy with Ryan Reynolds and The Last Duel with Matt Damon and Adam Driver. But her new role is more low-key: Prima Facie is a one-woman play about a barrister who defends rapists, before becoming a victim herself. She pulled out of Ridley Scott’s new film, Napoleon, to do it (that role will now be played by Vanessa Kirby).
‘That decision was actually taken out of my hands,’ she admits. ‘The scheduling kept changing, and I was always committed to the play. So it came to a point where it was impossible to do both.’ It’s safe to assume that one of those jobs is significantly better paid than the other, and she could have pulled out of the play to take the money.
‘Ha! Yeah,’ she laughs, ‘but I never got into this for the pay cheque. I’m going to grow so much from this experience. Sometimes opportunities present themselves and you’re like, if I say no, it will be purely out of fear. If I said no to this because I was scared and then they announced another actress, I’d want to punch myself in the face.’
Comer threw herself into research, speaking to barristers and a Rasso (rape and serious sexual offences) officer. ‘Because Napoleon fell through, I’ve had this time to speak to people who have been so open and honest, which has been amazing,’ she says. ‘They care so much about what they’re doing, but it’s very evident that the system doesn’t work for women. If a woman reports being raped, it’s her who’s on trial. She’s given this burden of responsibility to prove what happened.’
Thirty tickets at each performance will be available at a ‘pay what you can’ price, something Comer feels strongly about, telling me ‘theatre shouldn’t be this exclusive club. That’s so wrong.’ She is aware of the privilege that gave many in her industry a leg-up, and talks of the twist of fate that introduced her to Stephen Graham. They met on 2012’s Liverpool-set drama Good Cop, and he introduced her to his agent. Comer and Graham worked together again last year on Help, a Channel 4 drama set in a care home during the first lockdown, and a rare outing for her real (Scouse) accent. ‘I’d never done a project like that before, which is political and really raw because many people were still living through it,’ she says. ‘We really felt the weight of how important it was.’
It is testament to her transformative ability that playing a Liverpudlian care worker doesn’t feel at odds with the Comer we see on the red carpet or in a fashion shoot like the one on the cover of this magazine. ‘I sent over a plethora of young Meryl Streep images,’ she laughs of the mood board for this shoot. ‘They were pared back, very simple, which I really enjoyed. It’s important to me now to feel comfortable. I said to my stylist, Elizabeth [Saltzman, who also works with Gwyneth Paltrow], as we moved out of lockdown: it’s great to wear fabulous clothes that you wouldn’t usually wear, but actually I want to be comfortable and look back on those moments and see that.’
Today she’s wearing workout clothes — a black T-shirt and leggings — because ‘my iron’s broke and everything else is scrunched up’. Comer’s style revelation wasn’t the only change of the past couple of years. ‘We were all forced to pause and evaluate what’s really meaningful to us,’ she says. ‘I realised I love being at home and enjoy simpler things. Like having my close friends, not feeling the need to be certain places and please certain people. I grew up a lot. I really stepped into myself. I’ve got calmer and more secure in who I am. I mean,’ she adds hastily, ‘I’ve by no means got it all sussed out. That’s a lifelong thing.’
Comer and her family are tight. As we talk, she plays with a large heart-shaped Loquet locket; a gift from her mum, Donna. ‘It has amethyst in it, and a little moon charm. I have a habit of fiddling with it when I’m nervous.’ She has said in the past that she would like to live at home in Liverpool with Donna and her dad, Jimmy, until she is ‘old and grey’. But now she has a place in London, although who she lives with is unclear because she never talks about that side of her life.
‘It’s increasingly important to manage those things,’ she says carefully. ‘So much is out of your control so the parts of your life that you can control become really sacred.’ I’m impressed that they avoid ever being papped. ‘If I go to a party, I want to be in my mate’s living room listening to Fall Out Boy on a playlist of early 2000s hits,’ she says. ‘That’s where I’m letting my hair down, not at an event where I’m seen leaving. That terrifies me.’
As she approaches her 30s, she has also learned to care less about what other people think. No small feat in her job, where you are relentlessly presented with other people’s opinions. ‘I’ve got a different outlook on what success is,’ she explains. ‘Now it comes down to how I feel when I come home from a day’s work. If I feel proud of myself. I’m much better at not putting that on the opinions of others, because I did for a really long time.’
Was there a turning point? ‘You just become aware of your habits…. I was seeking a lot of approval and my happiness was dependent on it, then I realised how shit that made me feel.’ Is it things like stepping back from social media and not reading reviews? ‘Yeah. If I’m doing a job for me then, whatever the reaction may be, I can say, okay that’s unfortunate, however I gained X, Y and Z from this.’ (Despite the Scouse accent, she says ‘zee’ rather than ‘zed’.) Not that Comer has experienced many bad reviews. Even mixed reviews of the last season of Killing Eve fell over themselves to say that she remained amazing. There was a brief attempt to ‘cancel’ her on social media, when it was rumoured her boyfriend was a Republican. Regardless of her boyfriend’s political views, I don’t think anyone — particularly a person involved in projects such as Help and Prima Facie — should be bullied into proving their liberal credentials.
I ask the name of her favourite WhatsApp group and she replies instantly: ‘Me and my best mates from school are all over the place, so it’s called Hoes in Different Area Codes.’ She laughs uproariously. ‘It’s Katarina [Johnson-Thompson], she’s an Olympic athlete so she’s always away training. My friend Charlotte is an artist, she lives in Spain. Then my other friends are in Liverpool. We managed to get together for a weekend last year and it was amazing. Friends are such medicine. The person that you can fall into being when you’re in their company is just so pure. I mean, the title of our WhatsApp group isn’t pure!’
When Comer talks about her friends and family, she glows with warmth. Perhaps this solid background is the secret to her success because she says the energy you bring to an audition is vital. She doesn’t have to audition much these days, but she remembers the anxiety of her early career, when she had been on Holby City and Waterloo Road but wasn’t continuously working so got a job in Tesco. ‘There were a couple years where I’d done acting jobs, but also I needed money to go out at the weekend with my friends,’ she smiles. ‘I was on the tills on the Saturday/Sunday shift, so was hungover 99.9 per cent of the time.’
I sympathise, having worked on a checkout at the same age, but in Waitrose. ‘Oh, you’re so fancy!’ Her face lights up again. ‘I was trying to explain Waitrose to my boyfriend the other day. He said, “Is that like Whole Foods?” I told him it’s not as fancy as Whole Foods, but it’s fancy.’ It’s fancier than Tesco, but not as fancy as M&S? ‘I love an M&S,’ she sighs dreamily. ‘One thing that I find deeply satisfying is doing a good food shop.’
And this is the real Jodie Comer: texting her mates, hanging out with her boyfriend, doing a big food shop and, today, dealing with a broken iron. ‘I called my mum and she said it’s the fuse, so I’m going fuse shopping now,’ she laughs. ‘So rock ’n’ roll.’
The final season of ‘Killing Eve’ is on BBC iPlayer now. ‘Prima Facie’ is at the Harold Pinter Theatre from 15 Apr to 18 Jun (haroldpintertheatre.co.uk)
The New York Times-




Across four seasons, the bodies mounted as their characters’ mutual obsession deepened. But like all relationships, this one, too, had to come to an end.
BEVERLY HILLS, Calif. — Sandra Oh and Jodie Comer locked eyes across a fish tank. Illuminated in the blue glow of bubbling water and artificial light, the two women slowly registered each other with puzzlement, hostility and abject longing. Across three seasons of “Killing Eve,” the two actresses and the show’s creative team have worked to master the complex bond between their two characters, and there it was, distilled in a single “Romeo + Juliet”-inspired moment.
And then a wayward fish ruined the shot.
“Dude!” Oh exclaimed, still exasperated months later. The fish, which show up in the first episode of the show’s fourth and final season, were exceedingly “difficult,” Comer explained, laughing.
“One just swam right through and literally blocked both eyes,” she said. “I was like, ‘Guys, I can’t work with this fish.’”
Audiences won’t find out if the former MI6 agent Eve (played by Oh) and the globetrotting assassin Villanelle (Comer) are fated to wind up like Shakespeare’s star-crossed lovers until the series finale of “Killing Eve” airs this spring. (The first of eight episodes will air Sunday on BBC America and Monday on AMC; the first two start streaming Sunday on AMC+.)
The show was an instant critical hit when it premiered in 2018. Oh, who also serves as an executive producer, has been nominated for three Emmys for her performance. (In 2019, she won a Golden Globe.) Comer also nabbed multiple Emmy nominations, winning the award in 2019. The new season, like so many other projects, was delayed because of pandemic-era shooting complications.
Offscreen, the mutual obsession the actresses embody in “Killing Eve” gives way to mutual affection and respect. On a crisp February morning, they sat across from me at a patio table at the Peninsula hotel, interacting with the ease of old friends and the reverence of colleagues who have witnessed each other at the peak of their craft.
Comer, who speaks with a soft Liverpudlian lilt, quickly ditched the patent midi skirt she had worn for an earlier photo shoot, in favor of a more comfortable pair of track pants. Dagger-like earrings still framed her face. The Ottawa-raised Oh reclined in a seersucker jacket and billowy pants and sipped from her trusty drink bottle, marked to track her hydration throughout the day. (On set, Oh had earned a reputation for being a one-woman “hydration station,” Comer said, with multiple vessels nearby at all times.)
What was your reaction when you learned how “Killing Eve” would end?
JODIE COMER It’s mixed emotions. I was kind of stunned. The beautiful thing about shooting the ending was that we were together on set, which was amazing. I don’t know how I feel about the ending, truth be told.
SANDRA OH I thought it was quite victorious. And I think we stayed true to the characters and to each other.
When did you find out the fate of your characters?
OH That was very much a work in progress. There are certain discussions that happened very early on, and then the pandemic happened and certain things were shifted. The discovery happened as we were building it. That’s as specific and as broad as I can say.
I do absolutely feel like this season, the season finale, we spend the most time together. Because it’s just correct and ready for the characters to be able ——
COMER To be in that space with each other.
Do you feel like this was the right time to end?
OH It is, because this is what’s happening. A lot of people describe this as a “cat and mouse,” and I understand that within the first season. But I’ve got to tell you, if you’re going to continue describing it like that you haven’t watched the show. That’s too easy. For me, the show is really exploring the female psyche and how these two female characters need one another. Doing that digging within the context of a certain type of thriller, it was the right time to end.
COMER It’s the trickiest thing to execute, you know? Trying to move the characters forward in a way that feels truthful but also keeping all those pieces that people love so much. Their relationship means something so personal to each person who watches it.
And the show doesn’t put a label on Eve and Villanelle’s relationship.
COMER I find it quite difficult when people are like, “What is this relationship?” It’s so hard to put a name on that.
OH More and more, I find that a very restrictive type of question, because it needs to be as wide as possible. I’m not gonna tell you nothin’. Because it doesn’t matter.
COMER Sandra and I don’t speak a lot [to each other] about what we’re doing before we get to set. And then when it feels good, it feels good. So we’re constantly making those discoveries ourselves.
OH That’s some of the best stuff in what we do in filmmaking. You can set up certain circumstances and then something unscripted will happen, and that’s actually what to follow.
How has having a different woman serving as showrunner each season [Phoebe Waller-Bridge, followed by Emerald Fennell, Suzanne Heathcote and Laura Neal] influenced the series as a whole?
COMER Without a doubt, each brings their own feelings and intuitions of what they believe the characters would be doing. What I’ve enjoyed about that is the opportunity to sit at a table with everyone and really discuss and unravel what it is that feels true. To be included in those conversations, it’s been amazing. Prior to “Killing Eve,” it’s like, you show up to set, you learn your lines, you do your job and you go home.
OH It’s been the biggest avenue of growth. Because it’s very challenging. If you’re a sausage maker, you know that that’s a challenging way to make sausage. But what that sparks is a natural place for friction, and I think that can be an extremely creative place.
Were there certain things on your bucket list that you wanted to accomplish in this final season?
OH I got to wear a wig!
COMER Oh, yeah! I remember when I saw that picture I was like, “Damn, Sandra.”
OH I got to wear two wigs! I got to wear a dress! I was so excited that my wardrobe expanded.
COMER There was a fire that I felt had gone out that I wanted back because I knew we were finishing. I wanted a snippet of the old Villanelle we once knew. She has gone on this journey with her moral compass and humanity, but I was like, I want her back, badder than ever.
OH Because a scorpion’s nature cannot change.
COMER Exactly.
Is that something you vocalized early on?
COMER Yeah. Those conversations were always open, like, “Is there anything that maybe didn’t resonate with you or something that you want to expand on?” There was never something I couldn’t bring up.
What this show has always encouraged, especially about finding Villanelle, was, “Try something!” If it’s silly, if it’s over the top, if it doesn’t work, it’s fine.” There’s such a freeness that I have definitely taken on.
So many of your line readings are completely unexpected, and I’ll think, ‘Did she just do that in the moment?’
OH Yep!
COMER I feel like I’m often just flying by the seat of my pants.
OH [Laughs.]
COMER: Is that the saying? Seat of my underpants?
OH No, no, no, no. “Seat of your pants” is correct.
When “Killing Eve” premiered in April 2018, the world was in a different place. We were mid-Trump presidency but prepandemic. How do you think the show has adapted to the shifting landscape, and what has it been able to offer viewers?
OH That’s a tricky question because I don’t want to say what it is. When we did come out, it was post-#MeToo, post-beginning of Time’s Up. It was an extremely magical, fortuitous time. The storytelling centered around women; most of the creative heads were women. We were able to give the world a gift, right? It was also just stylistically fresh. Conceptually, the genre was fresh. Other changes regarding the pandemic and the shifts politically, that’s up to the audience.
COMER I feel like it’s sometimes pure escapism.
Like viewers getting to see Europe while stuck at home during the pandemic.
COMER Well, we had to do a lot of cheating this season because of Covid.
OH That’s a terrible reveal, but it’s so true.
COMER The art department and set design had to pull together to recreate these places that we were visiting. Everyone really had to step up in a different way.
Were you able to shoot anything outside of Britain?
COMER No.
OH Which is sad. But it is what it is. We’re shooting during the pandemic, blah, blah, blah.
What did your last day on set entail?
OH All we can say is that we were together.
And emotionally?
OH We were also probably together. [Laughs.]
COMER Very together.
OH For me, it was very, very heightened. It was very hard.
Is that fish tank scene in the Season 4 premiere an intentional homage to Baz Luhrmann’s “Romeo + Juliet”?
OH Yes, for sure. We even thought about doing the hand thing, and we did not shy away from certain film references. Like when Eve is following Hélène [Camille Cottin], and she’s in that blonde wig, I remember talking to Stella Corradi, our director, about Faye Wong in “Chungking Express.” I was like, “I want to look like her.” I love the richness of bringing in the history of images and how they can fit into our story.
Looking back, what does the awards recognition you received for “Eve” mean to you?
COMER I remember going to the Golden Globes that first year, and Sandra won and we were all just like, “This is amazing!” It felt like such a celebration. Of course, there is always a moment of gratification, but your sense of fulfillment comes from actually doing the work.
OH Those trophies are lovely and nice. But as you continue on deeper into your career, the significance of that changes. We made something together. It’s concrete. It can’t be taken away from us. And most of all, the growth, confidence, maturity, expansion, everything that got us here, can’t be taken away. It’s those things that take up much more meaning and space.
Who is your icon from Hollywood history?
Jodie Comer
The Last Duel
“I had just started secondary school and I got paid £200. I felt like the richest person in the world”
Tell us about your first ever audition.
“I had just started secondary school and my drama teacher drove me. It was for a radio play called Tin Man. I got it and I got paid £200. I felt like the richest person in the world.”
What advice would you give to your younger self?
“Your grandparents are the coolest people you’re ever going to meet. Spend as much time with them as you possibly can.”


The Killing Eve star discusses the series’ final season, and working with Matt Damon and Adam Driver in The Last Duel.
Tell me how The Last Duel came to you.
Via an email through my agent, as [roles] usually do. It said that Ridley [Scott] wanted to meet me, so I met him at his offices in London. It was just a general chat, really; he was asking me a lot of questions about my life. And then he goes, “So, what did you think of the script?” I hadn’t actually been sent the script, but luckily I had read some of the book beforehand as homework. There was a slight miscommunication—I didn’t know any of the materials. He was like, “Right. I want you to go away, read it, and give me your honest opinion.” The next day, as soon as it got hand-delivered to the door and I read it, I was like, “Yes. Yes, yes, yes.”
Was he familiar with you from Killing Eve?
Yeah, apparently he’s a big Killing Eve supporter…which is great for me! [Laughs] I was very happy to hear that.
Is playing Villanelle liberating?
Yes. I mean, so liberating—and also exhausting. I didn’t realize quite how much, but we obviously had a bit of a break before we went back to shooting season 4. We had a yearlong hiatus, and the first week back doing the final season, I was like, “Whoa, okay, I’ve got to get back into this.” But I think it was good to have a little bit of space and be myself, solidly, for a good half of a year.
And to not have to wear little onesies, as you do in season 2.
Really tight, age-12 boys pajamas. [Laughs] No—that was a relief.
Villanelle’s costumes are kind of genius.
They’re such a huge, fun part of doing that show. Comfort is key with her, which I always appreciated. When I first read that she was a Russian assassin living in France, I thought, Oh no, are they going to have her scaling walls in seven-inch heels? They were like, “No, because that doesn’t make any sense.” So, it was great to have flat shoes.
But then you went straight into The Last Duel, which is set in France in the 1300s. Did you have to wear a corset?
Yes, but I don’t know if that was just a bit of cheating, to help a girl out, if you know what I mean. But no, the costumes were incredible. Ridley really liked these wooden clogs that were two sizes too big and made out of pure wood,because of the way they sounded on the cobbles. So I was shuffling around most of the time, trying to keep my shoes on.
You have a very extreme scene in The Last Duel. Was that difficult to shoot?
There are larger, more dramatic scenes within The Last Duel, especially in regard to the assault itself, and also the questioning within the court. As an actor, when you come to those kinds of scenes—the scenes you think of for months and months on end—you hope that you give them some justice. But it was an incredible atmosphere on set to work with Ridley. He works with four or five cameras rolling the entire time. So it’s not a very quick process, because he doesn’t miss a beat. He always allows you the time, but it just forces everyone to be really on the ball and very, very present.
He goes fast.
He does. We shot [Comer’s character] Marguerite’s perspective first, before we ever delved into another perspective. Which was great, because then I felt secure in knowing that I’d captured her story, and then I could play around.
Is there a film that makes you cry?
Billy Elliot definitely makes me cry. And very recently, I watched CODA, which I think is just so, so breathtaking. I watched it about two weeks ago and was like, Wow, it’s been a while since a movie has really moved me in that way.
Are you an ugly crier?
Of course I am. I only want to hang out with ugly criers. I don’t want to know you if you’re a pretty crier. Where’s the fun in that? I love a good cry.
Do you get starstruck?
I do get starstruck. Most recently, I met Stormzy at a concert. He came up to me out of nowhere and gave me a huge hug and was just like, “I think you’re brilliant.” And I was like, “What do you mean? When do you have time to watch the television?” That was really lovely, and I was very, very much lost for words.
You weren’t starstruck when you met Ben Affleck?
Well, yeah. I mean, all of those guys. Adam [Driver], Matt [Damon], Ben…it’s so surreal when you’ve spent a lot of your life watching people through films and television, and then you end up being in a room, sat on a table with them, and they’re asking you, “Hey, what do you think?” or saying, “We want your input.” And you’re like, “Oh wow, how did I get here?”









Fresh off the set of their upcoming project ‘Help’, the Emmy-winning actress talks to friend and fellow Liverpool native Stephen Graham about destiny, playing Scousers and getting the call from Hollywood.
How cool is Jodie Comer? Prodigious talent and an enviable screen magnetism have resulted in an Emmy and a BAFTA for her explosive performance as a psychopathic Russian assassin, arguably one of the most complex, multilayered characters to grace the small screen in years. There is a fearless honesty to her acting that seems to set her apart from her co-stars no matter what role she’s playing, from Ivy in Thirteen to Lizzie in The White Princess, and then of course, Villanelle in Killing Eve. Her co-workers attest to her being a right laugh, down-to-earth and generous to a fault on set. And she looks killer in a clown suit.
Now 28, Comer has been acting professionally since she was 13, but it was a small part in the BBC drama Good Cop, opposite acclaimed actor Stephen Graham, that kick-started what is shaping up to be an incredibly exciting career, one in which she is this year making the leap from small- to big-screen lead. Free Guy, an action comedy in which she stars alongside Ryan Reynolds, will finally be released this summer, with The Last Duel – a historical drama starring Hollywood heavyweights Matt Damon, Ben Affleck and Adam Driver and directed by Ridley Scott – following in the autumn. Comer is also Ridley’s choice to play Empress Joséphine, opposite Joaquin Phoenix, in his upcoming Napoleon epic Kitbag, so he clearly thinks she’s pretty cool too.
But her most recent gig is Help, a story that shines a light on the tragic impact of coronavirus on care homes in the UK at the start of the pandemic, and one that reunites her with her friend and supporter Stephen Graham. Having recently wrapped filming on set in their hometown of Liverpool, the pair catch up on their history and swap set stories, sharing personal experiences of working in Hollywood
Stephen Graham: Do you remember how we met?
Jodie Comer: Of course I do, it changed my life forever. It was a lifetime ago now, but I remember it so well. We were filming Good Cop. I was only filming for one day and I remember how much you took me under your wing, and then it was from there that you introduced me to Jane [Epstein, Graham’s agent]. To think, that one day really did change everything for me, in the fact that you gave me a little nudge in the right direction. Because I don’t like to think where I would be if you hadn’t done that.
SG: I believe in the balances of fortune and fate. I feel like it was predestined and you would have gone on to do what you do, but I was just a little part of that journey. But I just remember being blown away by your talent in rehearsal. And I knew I was going to have to speak to my agent about you.
JC: Well, I think I was just so eager to get on my mark, know my lines and be there for everyone else who was doing a much bigger job than me. I had such a tiny part in it, but I remember you made it such a collaboration. And then I was on the train a couple of weeks later with my old agent, going to an audition that I really didn’t want to go to, and you called and said, “Don’t go to it – come and meet Jane.” And I didn’t go to the audition, I met Jane, which is very naughty. But it was meant to be.
SG: Yeah, it was. But before that, when did you first think, “Oh I really want to do this acting thing”? Was it at school? How did it come about?
JC: I remember it so vividly. It was at the Liverpool Theatre Festival. I was probably about 12. I was doing a piece written by a local playwright about the Hillsborough disaster. It was quite emotional, and I was crying before I’d even introduced myself.
That was the first time my dad had seen me act. Before I went on, he was like, “Just do your best.” But inside he was thinking, “Fucking hell, she’s going to get up there and I don’t know if she’s going to be any good. I want her to be good, but I don’t know if she’s going to be any good.” And then I remember doing it, and I remember seeing his face. And I thought, “If I’ve impressed my dad, maybe I’m all right.”
I’d done a radio play, working with actors from soaps, and they were the ones who said, “You could do this as a career.” It had never entered my head that this was an occupation. This was something I did on the weekend with my mates that I just loved. But winning the festival – and seeing how proud my dad was – I think that was a big turning point for me.
SG: We’re very similar in that respect. Like me, your family is massively important to you. I know how close you are. You’ve talked about the support from your mum and dad and how they enabled you to follow your dream.
JC: I remember [when I was young] when my dad drove me to an audition in Leeds, and I was sitting in the car, practising my lines, and my character’s swearing. And my dad was like, “I’m driving my 12-year-old daughter to an audition in Leeds, and she’s telling me to fuck off. What am I encouraging her to do?” But even though they didn’t have a clue about the acting world, they could see how much I wanted to do it, and they’ve just been so proud and given me the space to make my own decisions. My dad is always like, “Trust yourself, young Skywalker.”
SG: So when was the moment you thought to yourself, “Hang on, this could be my career”?
JC: God, I don’t know. I don’t know if I’ve ever had that conscious moment. I feel like each experience brings a newfound confidence or certainty with it. When I got Silent Witness, I was like, “Yes!” I felt like I’d proved myself. And My Mad Fat Diary was a big one. I remember going, “Wow, I’m going to be in something for six whole episodes.” And then with Thirteen, that was my first lead, and I was like, “Wow, this is a big responsibility.” And then obviously Killing Eve… I don’t know how you feel about this, whether you have one specific thing. But for me it’s like each step I take gives me something. As opposed to it being one kind of euphoric “this is it” moment.
SG: Yeah, you’re constantly learning, aren’t you? Gaining that education as you go along. And experience comes from actually being on the job. Because you never went down that drama-school route, did you? So all of your learning, and all of the knowledge you’re gaining, is primarily through experience. I think that makes you one of the most instinctive actors I’ve ever worked with.
JC: But so are you. I think that’s why we enjoy working together so much. But yeah, I think you’re right in that sense, because when I think back to being in audition rooms, I’d be in rooms with girls who had, like, three pages of notes. And I’d be thinking, well I haven’t done that kind of preparation, everything is always kind of on how I feel. But I guess everyone has their process, right? And you need to try to not look at what everyone else is doing and worry that you’re not doing the same.
SG: Yeah, of course. Drama schools are great and are excellent places for people to learn about the craft. But as soon as you get on set, it’s a completely different ball game. You can’t teach the minimalism that is needed when you’re on camera.
JC: No, you can’t teach how to feel. And when I was very young, it was always at the surface, and I just never knew how to control it. But I know that you’re the same, I’ve seen it on The Virtues. But even on Help I saw the way you access your vulnerability. I think it is incredible and was amazing to see up close.
SG: Help was a wonderful experience, and it was lovely for me to share that with you because of where we’ve both come from. We’re both kind of paving the way in our own journeys. In Help, you play Scouse, and I don’t think you’ve done that since the first time we worked together.
JC: No, I haven’t. Starting out, apart from Good Cop, I was always asked to change my accents in auditions. Which was fine – I always felt like accents helped me separate myself from my character. But there was definitely something lovely playing my own accent and showing the kind of woman that’s a part of me. And also the kind of woman I know so well. I found it quite exposing, actually, doing my own accent in such a bare, stripped-back way. But it was also something I really enjoyed, it felt like a celebration.
SG: I can’t wait for the world to see you playing this aspect of yourself in your true accent. Because to me, and I’m not just saying it because you’re like a little sister to me, it’s as powerful as Carol White in Cathy Come Home or Julie Walters in Boys from the Blackstuff – those really powerful, strong, visceral, fucking guttural women. But you’ve done it in such a modern way.
And it’s exciting to see, as it’s such a departure from all these other characters you’ve played, especially the magnificent Villanelle, for whom you’ve just had a fourth BAFTA nomination. How did that come about and how much did you help create that character?
JC: Well, I remember I’d seen Fleabag, and was obsessed with Phoebe [Waller-Bridge], and then, lo and behold, episode one of Killing Eve came through on a script. You can tell something’s special just by the writing, and I’d never, ever read anything like Phoebe’s script. And when creating it, we all felt a buzz, but didn’t quite know what it was going to be. And then it came to life in a way that none of us had ever imagined. And for me personally, I think what Villanelle has taught me is to be a little bit fearless.
Before I played Villanelle, a crew show was the most intimidating thing for me, even though the crew are on my side. I would always be so conscious of myself and my body. But with Villanelle I thought, if I’m going to fall on my face, I’m just going to get back up and try something else.
And I think that’s still in me going forward – to take risks and not be so self-conscious, and I’ve really enjoyed finding the freedom in that. And I’ve learnt that things can be flamboyant and in your face, but you always need to try to find where the truth is rooted.
SG: Yes, and we can tell how much fun you’re having while also completely believing that character, because you made it your own.
JC: There’s a scary amount of myself in there. Part of the whole collaboration with Phoebe on the first season was that she would write while watching the rushes – writing in and amplifying things I was doing. But we were constantly having to walk a tightrope of how much empathy we gave her, or how much we let people in. Because people are so invested in her and her relationship with Eve. At the beginning she was just this psychopath assassin, but she’s so much more than that now. You can’t put her into a box anymore.
SG: That’s interesting that you say a lot of your character is in her, and I can see that – you do have to find a way in. Did the accent and costumes help you find the character? I’ve got a weird thing where it’s all about the shoes for me, and once I find them shoes, I can find a walk.
JC: My favourite thing was that whenever you got a new costume, you’d come and find me and do your little walk around the room in your costume and say, “It’s boss, isn’t it?” It was my favourite thing.
But yeah, I have an amazing accent coach, Budgie. I remember in the last season, Villanelle had to do a Scottish accent. And we spent a week doing this accent, really pushing it to the extremes. And then we’d be like, “Oh no, that’s a bit too Lorraine Kelly.” With the accents, I always find the best way is to push it to as far as you possibly can, and then when the moment comes, it’s a lot easier to bring it back. But you’re amazing with accents as well – do you have a coach?
SG: No, but I do work with coaches occasionally. For me, in the beginning, when I was playing a lot of Scouse roles, I could feel that I was possibly going to be typecast. Like that was going to be me for the rest of my days. So I did make a conscious decision to try to do things that weren’t just me being Scouse. But then I decided to go back to playing Scouse, because if I’m really honest, I want kids to see and hear me on the telly and go, “Well if he can do it, maybe I can too.” Because there weren’t many Scousers on the telly at that particular time.
JC: That’s so true. I remember, when I was younger, going for a theatre job, which I did end up getting but afterwards the director told me I was the only girl from the northwest who had gone in for it. And before I auditioned, she questioned whether I could even change my accent.
SG: Yeah, for me it was Martin Scorsese who had faith in me and gave me that opportunity to play the part of Al Capone. He didn’t have any reservations, he just offered me to do the part. And I did it, and at first I was very nervous, but I proved that I could do it and had a lovely time doing it. I’m not sure if I would have got that same opportunity over here in the UK, if I’m being honest. That’s actually a nice segue to the film you’ve just done with Ryan Reynolds – your first Hollywood film. Isn’t it amazing that we’re two kids from Liverpool having this conversation?
JC: [Laughing.] Yeah
SG: So how did you feel when you first went over there and when you were on set? What’s the difference between the little stuff you’ve been doing in England and the big Hollywood movies? I get asked this question a lot, so it’s lovely to ask someone else.
JC: I remember getting there and just being like, “This is so much bigger than me, this is a monster of a production.” My character is in a video game, so a lot of it was about visuals, and I’d never really done any green screen. So then you’re having to spend the entire day imagining what it is that you’re looking at or acting with. And doing it with conviction. Superhero movies have never been something that I’d usually gravitated towards. But after doing Free Guy, I had a whole new-found respect for actors who predominantly work on them. Because I rely so much on what the other actor is giving me. So to have that missing was really hard.
But the team was incredible. Ryan is just stupidly nice, wonderful. And Shawn Levy, the director, was the same. You know what it’s like, whoever is leading the cast usually sets the precedent – if they’re an arsehole, then everyone is going to feel in a bad mood, it just rolls downhill. But with Ryan and Shawn leading it, it was just the most joyous set to be on. And very nurturing.
SG: And you’ve just done another whopper, whopper film, with a whopper director. Ridley Scott, the legend that is Ridley Scott.
JC: Sir Ridley Scott!
SG: Sir Ridley Scott, of course, yes, Sir Ridley Scott. And you got to work with three wonderful actors on the show. Matt Damon, who I think is fantastic. And Ben Affleck. Oh, and that lovely lad, Adam Driver, he’s fucking phenomenal.
JC: Yeah, he’s incredible.
SG: So, what was it like then, sis, when you got the call? Was it exciting or are you just getting used to them now, like, “Yeah, another Hollywood movie… ”?
JC: No, no! For The Last Duel, there was actually this whole confusion. I was told Ridley really wanted to meet me, but that I couldn’t read the script. And then we were chatting away in his office – you know he’s a Geordie? – and he asked me what I thought about the script! And I told him I hadn’t been given it and he was like, “What?” Then he said, “Right, I’m going to give it to you, I want you to go away, read it and let me know what you think.”
I thought the script was brilliant. I thought the way they’d approached the subject matter was phenomenal, and I just wanted to bite the hands off them, you know, for the opportunity to work with Ridley, and Adam and Matt and Ben and Nicole [Holofcener, co-writer of the screenplay]. It’s just a really, really clever script. And filming was just incredible. Ridley works in such a particular way, he has four or five cameras rolling the whole time. And he knows exactly what he wants, he’s meticulous. And he gives you the space to do what you want.
SG: Did you do many takes or does he know what he wants, and when he gets it, he’s like, “Yeah, we’ve got it”?
JC: When he’s happy, he’ll ask you if there’s anything you want to do. I think he really enjoys you giving him something new, he likes to see you playing around, and maybe giving him something he didn’t initially think of. It was amazing being able to have four cameras on you, and two takes, one if you want to play around. You’re not doing it for 12 hours, you know?
SG: Yeah!
JC: You know what it’s like – sometimes you’re doing it all day! But I felt so lucky to be a part of it, and I also feel like I really grew up on that set. There was something in me that really kind of shifted. I read an interview recently with an incredible actress, of my age, called Olivia Cooke. She said, “A fairy isn’t going to die if you say that you’re good at your job.” It’s so true, you should feel comfortable about saying, “I feel like I did a good job.”
SG: Of course, yeah. And actually, that brings me to another question I’ve been wanting to ask you. Has there ever been a moment in your career where you felt that kind of imposter syndrome and that kind of old working-class mentality? Have you ever felt that or has it never affected you?
JC: I think I feel it all the time! Because you go to America and you do these huge things, and then you think, “But I’m from the UK. I’m from a little city called Liverpool and, you know, I live with my mum and dad.” And I feel like you make everything very small. When they’re actually not. But I always feel lucky to be there when I look around at everyone else, knowing all the stuff they’ve done. You know that people are at different points in their life, but you still feel it. But the only space in which I never feel it is when the cameras are rolling. When we’re about to go for a take, it just disappears. Because then I feel like I am where I’m meant to be.
SG: I asked because, you know, I’ve had that as well, throughout my career, right up to when I was lucky enough to do The Irishman. I had a really nice scene with Al Pacino, and I started to get a little bit panicky, thinking, “I can’t do this, it’s Al Pacino.” I had to phone Hannah [Walters, Graham’s wife], and I was like, “Hannah, I don’t know if I can do this,” and she was like, “What do you mean?” I went, “My arse has gone numb. Honest to God, I’ve been to the toilet about six times, my bottle has gone, I don’t know if I can do it.” And she was like, “Stephen, behave yourself,” and I went, “Hannah, it’s Al fucking Pacino!”
JC: [Nodding.] It’s Al Pacino.
SG: And I went, “You don’t understand, I’ve had posters of the man on my wall since I was a kid. When I told my dad I wanted to be an actor, we went to the video shop and we got three fucking films, and one of them was The Godfather. Do you understand, it’s Al Pacino?” And she was going, “Stephen, it’s alright, you’re meant to be there.” And I had to believe I’d earned the right to be there, to just enjoy it. She talked me down and I went back in, and he was wonderful, they were all wonderful. But what you said before really resonated with me – there’s a moment where you feel like there’s a growth. I felt like that on This Is England. But on The Irishman, I was kind of like, “OK, relax, this is where you’re meant to be.”
JC: Yeah, I think with each job, it’s about finding the space to feel like you’re meant to be there, you’re meant to be doing this. And then for me, you look at the people you’re working with, who you’re inspired by, who you look up to, and then you get on set with them and they’re just like everybody else. They’re there to do the same job as you, and be as present as you, with you, in the room. And it becomes more important to me, who I collaborate with and work with. Because I feel like, since I’ve never been to drama school, I’m constantly learning from the people I’m surrounded by. And I feel so lucky to have been surrounded by the likes of you, basically. Everyone needs a Stephen Graham in their life.
SG: Aww, you’re such a joy on set. As a person, you’re so gregarious and your sense of humour is fucking brilliant. And what I love about you is that you treat every single person on set exactly the same, be it an executive producer or one of the lovely girls who makes tea. And I think that’s a beautiful quality to have.
JC: Oh, thank you, Stephen. Well, as you get older and do more, you become so much more aware of how important everyone is. When we wrapped on Help, I felt so emotional, saying goodbye to everyone, because I feel like what Help really solidified for me was the importance of teamwork. You know, we worked six-day weeks, not a lot of time, not a lot of money. Really heavy stuff, night shoots, one takes, and Mark Wolf, our incredible DOP, was like a third person in the room with us at all times. And I just thought, “Wow, this doesn’t work if we’re not all connected.” But I just love being on set. You know what it’s like, it’s just such good energy.
SG: Yeah. I think it’s fair to say we both love being on set.
JC: Yeah. Together, preferably.
SG: Yeah, definitely together.
On her role as a skincare ambassador
“For me, everything is about integrity, including my acting,” Jodie told R29. “I’ve got to believe in something if I’m going to put my time into it and I was blown away by Noble Panacea’s ethos and attitude towards what beauty is.” The brand was founded by Sir Fraser Stoddart, the 2016 Nobel Laureate for Chemistry, and champions active ingredients such as probiotics, which strengthen the skin’s barrier, and acids for gentle exfoliation. “There is so much science that has gone into these products and I think that’s authentic,” said Jodie.




Since working with the brand, Jodie has cut back on stockpiling hyped skincare products and now opts for a more minimal routine. “I actually feel embarrassed when I look at my cosmetic cupboard and I see all the products that I’ve bought because there’s always something new,” she said. Cleansing is the lynchpin in her morning and evening routine. “I always cleanse my skin,” she added. “If I’m filming and wearing a lot of makeup, I prefer something with a creamy, thicker texture and I love using a cleansing brush.”
What follows is super simple yet effective. “My skin actually gets clogged quite easily, so in the morning I just use the Radiant Resilience Moisturiser,” a mix of skin-repairing probiotics, pollution-busting minerals and soothing plant extracts. “What the brand champions is using the products in steps, so I also love the Brilliant Prime Radiance Serum when I’m working out,” which contains bakuchiol (nature’s answer to retinol) and exfoliating glycolic acid. “I hate my skin being dry but I don’t want too much on my skin,” added Jodie. “Then, I always use SPF 50,” something Jodie’s facialist, Jasmina Vico, has instilled in her. “Jasmina can be naughty and nice when it comes to my skin,” continued Jodie, who treats herself to the odd facial when she’s in London. “They can be a little bit painful but that’s when I know it’s doing my skin some good. I’d much rather get all the gunk out of my face.”
In the evening, Jodie speaks highly of the Overnight Recharge Cream. “But I try not to put too much on my face at night,” she said. “I really like rose or lavender water – something that will give my skin a little hydration boost. I try and keep it simple, and I find that if I change things up too much, I don’t notice a positive difference on my skin. I leave things like retinol to the experts because I feel like something could go horribly wrong.
On being mindful when it comes to beauty
“Now, I’m more mindful about what I’m actually putting on my skin and into my body, and it helps that Noble Panacea ingredients are all clean,” said Jodie. All products are 100% fragrance-free, hypoallergenic and formulated without mineral oil, petrolatum, alcohol and paraffin, to name a few ingredients which may have the potential to irritate sensitive skin. “This never used to be important to me but it is now,” added Jodie. “I’m obsessed with the Overnight Recharge Creamin particular. When you wake up in the morning your skin is so moisturised and glowy and it starts you off on the right foot. I love the consistency of it, too. I hate it when a cream just dissolves into your skin but you don’t want it to be too thick either.”
Jodie’s approach to skincare has changed since learning more about efficacy and sustainability. “I feel like we always just slap our moisturiser on and can be quite rough with our face when washing it,” said Jodie. “I travel a lot with work, too,” she continued, “so the Recharge Cream’s small packages [each dose is individually wrapped to protect the product from light and air] are really useful and there’s zero waste.” The brand recently partnered with TerraCycle to source materials that are 100% nationally recyclable.
On the makeup products she can’t live without and the top tips she’s picked up on set
“Whenever anyone uses an Hourglass foundation on me, I love it. Also their highlighter palettes are so good,” revealed Jodie. “I also really like the Hourglass Hidden Corrective Concealer sticks but I like to warm the product up on my hand first and then apply it, as if you layer it, it can be quite thick.”
Jodie works with makeup artist Alex Babsky a lot and has learned some clever makeup hacks. “Recently, Alex was doing an eyeliner look on me that was kind of like a cat eye but so subtle and gorgeous. I always want to do a little flick but it always ends up on my forehead. I’m always trying to level it out and it always gets bigger and bigger. He gave me a top tip, though: start it from the centre of your eye and then wing it out, starting with a pencil and then a felt-tip liquid liner.”
“Another tip I learned is that once your lips are done, going around them with a little bit of concealer makes them seem a bit sharper and fuller,” said Jodie. “I really love a white or off-white eyeliner in my waterline to make my eyes look bigger, too, that’s a really nice touch. I also don’t put any mascara on my lower lashes, as it makes my eyes look smaller. But skin prep is also important. Whenever Hung Vanngo does my makeup, there is a face wash and a cleanser and two sheet masks and all of these things beforehand!”
On her iconic blonde hair
“I’m so lazy with my hair,” said Jodie, “but I love Olaplex and that’s the shampoo that I use.” Then it’s a simple spritz of sea salt spray (her hair hairstylist recently gave her Fudge) and she’s good to go. When Jodie is in the US, Harry Josh colours her hair, but when she’s back in the UK, John Clark at John Frieda takes over every five weeks. “The amazing thing is you get to try these amazing styles and colours out and it’s so fun to be able to play around like that,” said Jodie. But there’s one thing she’ll never try again: a fringe. “I got one on a whim one time and as soon as I walked out of the salon I thought, What have I done? Every time I had an event, I’d ask the stylists to please do something with it.”
On her everyday makeup look
“I like concealer and a little eyebrow gel so I don’t have to fill in my brows. I use MAC Brow Set in Clear because that stuff does not shift. I also have to have my Kevyn Aucoin eyelash curlers and I also like a nice cream blush, something super natural.”
On her Instagram-famous eyebrows
“My advice is: don’t touch them! I’m lazy with my brows and used to have no eyebrows so I’m scared to do anything to them,” said Jodie. “Actually, I’m very lucky they grew back. I let makeup artists tidy them up as long as they don’t go crazy, but I’d say leave as much as you can. I always used to draw mine on so heavy but I need to feather them slightly. Less is more with eyebrows.”
On her favourite Killing Eve beauty looks
“My favourite was the look from season one, episode three when [Villanelle] killed Bill,” said Jodie. “Even the costume was great, the jigsaw suit and plaits. We were filming in Berlin and she had Doc Martens on. What I imagine about Villanelle is that she is busy and doesn’t have the time to sit there and do her makeup. She’s free and being who she is. She is stripped back. As the seasons went on and the costumes became such a big thing, we had the opportunity to experiment. But she’s simple.”
On her favourite style picks
“You can’t underestimate the power of a good quality T-shirt and jeans,” said Jodie. She continued: “I love Agolde jeans. Mine split on the bum but I ordered them again because they’re so good. PAIGE jeans have great elasticity if you’re a girl who likes your food, like me! My friend also works at New Balance and when there’s a new shoe, she keeps me cool, but I’m very low maintenance.”
And if she’s going to spend her money? “I love a good Joseph jumper or knit, and I’m more of a pants and jacket girl. Recently, when the BAFTAs were virtual, my stylist got me a Duro Olowu dress, which had a low V-neck. When I put that on I thought, Why don’t I wear dresses more? I was obsessed. But it takes a special type of dress to sway me. I also just bought a new pair of black boots from Celine. These ones don’t cut off my calves and I can wear them with jeans and a dress.”
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